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Topic-icon Early Season Form Discussion - 2011/12

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9 years 4 months ago #1753

Your getting boring clan clover zzzzz. I never heard a so called supporter ever get so much on a coach or teams back as you do. Give it a rest. Judge when the season is over. You remind me off an old man in the main stand last year who was giving out because we were making to much noise when the team were making there before match half lap. Glass half full


Lads... He's as entitled to his opinion as the rest of us. If you don't like what he is writing then don't read it. There is even an ignore list if you want to hide him altogether.
I'm sure he's sick of reading what he sees as "apologist" posts as well.


A Connacht is not just for the Xmas Inter-Pros...
A Connacht is for Life

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9 years 4 months ago #1754

(1) you forget to mention the rent Leinster have to pay for the use of the RDS, you also fail to mention the loan for Thomand park and Ravenhill and the running of two stadia in Munster, you also left the cost(rent) associated with running the Cork side of the Munster operation.
(2) you forget to mention the wage bills for Munster ,Leinster and Ulster, which by estimates run into millions per each club
(3) So while your incoming figures may be correct you do not mention albeit only briefly outgoings.
(4) we have just two years left to prove ourselves, if we don't we are gone and that is the hard fact of reality.
(5) Also the hard fact of reality is the vast majority of our season ticket sales are purely down to been in the H Cup this year which is thanks to Leinster not anything Connacht Rugby has done. (6) they have to get it right
(7) the crowds get smaller they are a fickle lot


Right, let me briefly address your points one by one :-

(1) I didn't mention these because I don't know them. I do know I hugely understated the average ticket price for the other 3 provinces - tickets for Leinster last week were 30-50 euros, Munster have corporate boxes, Ulster have corporate boxes and about 1000 premier seats costing 600 to 1000 sterling a season - while overstating ours, in an effort to be fair.

It's also fair to point out, in support of what you say here, that Leinster have to split profits from the Aviva games with the IRFU. However their least profitable game there last season - Clermont - cleared them 700,000 in profit, more profit in one game than our gross seasonal ticket sales.

My point about the other provinces living in a different financial universe still stands.

(2) If they can afford to pay millions in wages, and the IRFU funding per province is identical, then that rather proves my point about the other provinces living in a different etc. and so on.

(3) Outgoings covered in (1) (2) above and are not relevant to my point - I would love to have their outgoings if we could have their incomings too :)

Attendance figures as supplied by provinces to Magners League and ERC:
Lenister    383,333
Munster    311,779
Ulster        119,929
Connacht    29,164

(4) They've been closing us down for 10 years and its never happened. Our season ticket sales this year are about equal with Leinster's average Celtic league attendance in the first few years of the league (back then Leinster were selling only a couple of hundred season tickets). Thanks to the setup of the GAA and closeness of the English Premier League, rugby is and will remain the *only* professional team sport in Ireland. Munster have taken 15 years to get where they are, Leinster only 10 - do think the IRFU is unaware of the potential for growth and profit from Connacht? I think their (horribly belated, admittedly) support shows they want 4 golden geese, not 3.

(5) No argument there. No H Cup maybe 400 season ticket holders, Heineken cup 3000. You can't argue with those figures.

(6) This "getting it right" thing is pure soccer talk. Fire the coach! Buy Carter! And Nonu! And Messi! Steady progress? Fie on your steady progress, I spit upon your incremental improvements!!!

If the Heineken Cup and Amlin Cup go to Pro12 teams, and some Welsh team wins the Anglo-Welsh reserve 15 nonsense, that leaves (at best) 8 of 12 teams with no trophy.

So what would success be for us? We finished 9th last season, exceeding that by even one placing would constitute progress (and, incidentally, would mean we've won most of our home matches).

As for the Heineken Cup, I'm just glad we're in it.

(7) It's often been said that Galway supporters are fickle (and I've often said it myself). They probably say the same about Cork in Munster. If we loose half the new season ticket holders next year we're still way ahead of where we were last year. There are a couple of things that make me think we won't - the facilities and atmosphere have improved and are an attraction as opposed to frightening people away; it's going to be damn hard to get a ticket for the interpros this year which will encourage people to get a season ticket for next year; the season tickets are phenomenal value.

Oh, and the kids! Kids, families everywhere. My eldest is only 5 so I only bring her to the afternoon games. She is perpetually pestering me as to when the next game is on.

Sort of like Bruce Willis in the sixth sense, I see Connacht jerseys. Everywhere! The future is both bright and green.

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9 years 4 months ago #1755

Right, let me briefly address your points one by one :-

(1) I didn't mention these because I don't know them. I do know I hugely understated the average ticket price for the other 3 provinces - tickets for Leinster last week were 30-50 euros, Munster have corporate boxes, Ulster have corporate boxes and about 1000 premier seats costing 600 to 1000 sterling a season - while overstating ours, in an effort to be fair.

It's also fair to point out, in support of what you say here, that Leinster have to split profits from the Aviva games with the IRFU. However their least profitable game there last season - Clermont - cleared them 700,000 in profit, more profit in one game than our gross seasonal ticket sales.

My point about the other provinces living in a different financial universe still stands.

(2) If they can afford to pay millions in wages, and the IRFU funding per province is identical, then that rather proves my point about the other provinces living in a different etc. and so on.

(3) Outgoings covered in (1) (2) above and are not relevant to my point - I would love to have their outgoings if we could have their incomings too :)

Attendance figures as supplied by provinces to Magners League and ERC:
Lenister    383,333
Munster    311,779
Ulster        119,929
Connacht    29,164

(4) They've been closing us down for 10 years and its never happened. Our season ticket sales this year are about equal with Leinster's average Celtic league attendance in the first few years of the league (back then Leinster were selling only a couple of hundred season tickets). Thanks to the setup of the GAA and closeness of the English Premier League, rugby is and will remain the *only* professional team sport in Ireland. Munster have taken 15 years to get where they are, Leinster only 10 - do think the IRFU is unaware of the potential for growth and profit from Connacht? I think their (horribly belated, admittedly) support shows they want 4 golden geese, not 3.

(5) No argument there. No H Cup maybe 400 season ticket holders, Heineken cup 3000. You can't argue with those figures.

(6) This "getting it right" thing is pure soccer talk. Fire the coach! Buy Carter! And Nonu! And Messi! Steady progress? Fie on your steady progress, I spit upon your incremental improvements!!!

If the Heineken Cup and Amlin Cup go to Pro12 teams, and some Welsh team wins the Anglo-Welsh reserve 15 nonsense, that leaves (at best) 8 of 12 teams with no trophy.

So what would success be for us? We finished 9th last season, exceeding that by even one placing would constitute progress (and, incidentally, would mean we've won most of our home matches).

As for the Heineken Cup, I'm just glad we're in it.

(7) It's often been said that Galway supporters are fickle (and I've often said it myself). They probably say the same about Cork in Munster. If we loose half the new season ticket holders next year we're still way ahead of where we were last year. There are a couple of things that make me think we won't - the facilities and atmosphere have improved and are an attraction as opposed to frightening people away; it's going to be damn hard to get a ticket for the interpros this year which will encourage people to get a season ticket for next year; the season tickets are phenomenal value.

Oh, and the kids! Kids, families everywhere. My eldest is only 5 so I only bring her to the afternoon games. She is perpetually pestering me as to when the next game is on.

Sort of like Bruce Willis in the sixth sense, I see Connacht jerseys. Everywhere! The future is both bright and green.


Its good to debate. And you have very good points some of which I agree on other I don't

Your point 1, Yes Ulster and Munster have corporate boxes, they also have massive loans they need to pay back for there new stadia.

point 2, It does prove your point a bit but it also proves mine, what they get in, is also not far away from what they pay out, hence why you have seen very little movement in new high profile players coming in this year, bar Leinster with all our old players.

point 3, is along the lines of point 2.

point 4, The Golden 4 as you put it, is more down to the wishes of the National coach then the big wigs, Yes they have been trying to close us down for 10 years and more, but this time they have drawn a line in the sand and asked us to make a stand, we fail we go.

Point 5, We agree on.

Point 6, you have dismissed, bad mistake . Not sure I like the reference to spitting no matter what context you put it in.

point 7. Again I disagree any backward movement in season ticket sales will look bad the graph has to go up not down. As you mentioned the facilities are there, no excuse to not walk through the door.

Kids I understand, I have a similar problem. The future is greener then it was and I hope it stays that way. Good debate keep it clean and keep it green.

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9 years 4 months ago #1756


Point 6, you have dismissed, bad mistake . Not sure I like the reference to spitting no matter what context you put it in.


It was meant as a humourous reference to the football attitude that success must be achieved yesterday, preferably by firing the coach, mortgaging your clubs future, and praying for a miracle. sorry if I missed the mark :)

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9 years 4 months ago #1757

It was meant as a humourous reference to the football attitude that success must be achieved yesterday, preferably by firing the coach, mortgaging your clubs future, and praying for a miracle. sorry if I missed the mark :)


No Worries, I don't follow football so i missed it. :(

Anyway as I said a good debate fair and clean, well done and take care.

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9 years 4 months ago #1758

it ended up as a good debate and i have grown to like you hope others do to. Clearly you have alot off passion for connacht. Just dont shoot eric yet. . .

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9 years 4 months ago #1761

Despite the in dept debate raging above, connachts survival was entrusted to ee. He has assembled the best team he could (his choice) and now must achieve the goals agreed with his employers.

To the best of my knowledge these goals are not In the public domain so we must guess as to what they are.

While I agree and accept borders no2 point that any slight improvement would under normal circumstances represent success that is not the case here. Failure to be in the hc next season will decimate ticket sales and that will effectively be the death knell of Connacht rugby as a pro entity.

Eric is on record as saying we have failed to achieve our early season targets, that's worrying and Eric will be his own harshest critic.

I am a pessimist, I don't think we have the necessary talent to be successful this season. I hope I am wrong.

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9 years 4 months ago #1762

Failure to be in the hc next season will decimate ticket sales and that will effectively be the death knell of Connacht rugby as a pro entity.


If you believe that our survival is predicated on being in the HC next year give up now.

We're not going to jump from 9th to 4th or 5th in the table, which is what besting Ulster would require; likewise we can't depend on Leinster winning the HC yet again.

Hope you're wonrg/afraid you're right.

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9 years 4 months ago #1766

Ummm with respect your confused, Benson is 27 and Rodders is only a Pup of 22, you're thinking of his younger brother Winston


You know what, I was even more confused. I was thinking of Shaun Treeby.


Justice 4 Faruk

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9 years 4 months ago #1769

@Umm - Winston? Benson? Is there a younger brother called Dunhill? Is the whole family named after cigarette brands?

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9 years 4 months ago #1770

Maybe there is an Irish qualified player called Sweet Afton.

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9 years 4 months ago #1775

Howya lads/ladies, long time reader, first time poster  :)
I was wondering about what was said about the IRFU only giving us 3 years and HC qualification being essential to our survival. Surely this years season ticket numbers must highlight the potential market in Connacht. Whether we achieve success in the near term or not, at least now they know what can happen when things go right. I thought I read in the Times a few weeks ago that our season ticket number were comparable to Ulster's. Although I could be wrong on that. 

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9 years 4 months ago #1776

Welcome aboard B_F....

Your right about ST number at Ravers, there is very little difference in numbers this season between Ulster & Connacht. You're basically talking a couple of hundred difference, although they'd be slightly more expensive across the board so bringing in more revenue per head. Big thing for Ulster is the New Stand which has massively increased their corporate revenue which is where the real money is at for all sports teams..

There's definitely a market for Connacht Rugby if they can get results, pricing, facilities and match times right. And no harm in being ambitious, but laced with a small does of pragmatism of course...

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9 years 4 months ago #1777

I've split off this discussion from the Leinster match thread because it has moved into a more general discussion....

As you were.... ;)

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